Speaker 0 00:00:00 <inaudible>
Speaker 1 00:00:34 You are listening to right on radio on cafe 90.3 FM and streaming live on the
[email protected]. I'm Josh Webber tonight on, right on radio, Ian Graham Lee's talks with Brian Freeman and New York times bestselling author of psychological thrillers, including the Jonathan stride and frost Eastern series about his latest works, the deep, deep snow and funeral for a friend. His books have been sold in 46 countries and 22 languages. And he was selected as the author to continue a Robert Ludlums Jason Bourne series.
Speaker 0 00:01:07 And I'm Annie Harvey in the last part of the hour, I'll be chatting with Mindy grayling, a member of the Minnesota house of representatives. For 20 years, she helped found the nation's first state mental health caucus, which successfully lobbied for a significant increase in Minnesota's mental health funding. She has served on the state and national boards of the national Alliance on mental illness or NAMI, and is on the university of Minnesota psychiatry, community advisory council, all this seminar. So stay tuned to write on radio. <inaudible> Josh, the engineer. Can't hear you, but I can hear you. You can hear me. Okay. I can hear how you doing, man.
Speaker 1 00:02:36 Good. Excellent. Good. Good to have you back on the show. Yeah, it's been a little while now. So I missed you with the, uh, the deep, deep snow one came out. What was that? Uh, February? Uh, yeah, January, even for any book, it just came out in paperback in October. Oh, okay. Well that's good. Well, we talked a little bit about both of them. Um, so man, you are prolific. What is going on with you this year?
Speaker 2 00:03:02 It has been, it has been quite the year for both book launches and writing books. Yeah.
Speaker 1 00:03:07 Well you, you're not getting a whole lot of book launches. I don't expect
Speaker 2 00:03:12 Virtual, which actually has been a good thing because it means I've, uh, uh, I I've at least had time to, to stay at home and right. If I actually had to go out on the road and do all these events, that would be a channel,
Speaker 1 00:03:21 Oh my God, we're going to get flooded with you next year. If you've been
Speaker 2 00:03:26 Like, you haven't been flooded with me this year.
Speaker 1 00:03:28 Exactly. I mean, this is really amazing. Um, so we've got the deep, deep snow and then thief river falls came out in February and you did the born evolution, which is Robert Lublin.
Speaker 2 00:03:41 Yup. That was July. And then for a friend and uh, in September. So yeah,
Speaker 1 00:03:45 So just an amazing amount of stuff. So it's a Z and ground lease. Cara, I'm speaking with my good friend, Brian Freeman, who is an internationally and New York times best selling author of mystery and detective and psychological suspense novels, including spilled blood, which won the 2013. I to, uh, it w thriller award for best hardcover novel, pretty good. His books have been sold in 45 countries and, uh, 22 languages and appeared as a main selections in the literary Guild and the book of the month club, um, that doesn't even seem close to, uh, what you've been doing lately. That's a description from your, uh, from your kits, your publishing.
Speaker 2 00:04:34 I know I, I look back on, uh, on how this all started 15 years ago. And I think, gosh, I was, I was doing a book a year back then that it kind of feels like a vacation at this point. Yeah,
Speaker 1 00:04:44 I bet it does. Yeah. And so is, are you planning to keep this up?
Speaker 2 00:04:50 Uh, it it's, it's, uh, I've, I've got deals with four separate publishers at, at this point. And, uh, and so, you know, the, the, the good thing is they're, they're asking for content, which, which I love, and they're all very different stories and characters and approaches. So I love the, just the sheer diversity of projects that I've got on my plate. That's kind of what keeps me creatively energized. Uh, but at the same time, I think it's an open question, you know, is it, is it three books a year for the foreseeable future or, or will I be institutionalized?
Speaker 1 00:05:22 Well, we're all gonna need that. I think pretty soon. That's true. Yeah. So tell us, start off with, you know, we'll get to, um, a funeral for a friend, which is a main focus tonight, and I'll have you read a little bit from that in a minute, but let's talk a little bit about the deep snow, which is a standalone. And, um, uh, but I think I'd like to start with just explaining it to people, having you explain to people what the, uh, Robert Ludlum thing is, you know, and how, how you managed to get selected to over that franchise. Can you talk, talk a bit about that?
Speaker 2 00:06:00 Yeah, absolutely. That was such an amazing honor. Uh, it was probably right around two years ago that I got a call from my agent and she said that, uh, that Putnam had, uh, taken over the, the Jason Bourne series and, uh, done a two book deal with the Robert Ludlum estate. And they were looking for a new author to take over the Jason Bourne series. And it was, I interested in, you know, tossing my hat into the ring and I've been a Ludlam fan my whole life. I can remember reading the Bourne identity all the way back when it came out in 1980 when I was all of 17 years old. So I said, yeah, let's, let's give it a try. And, uh, so they, um, she tossed my hat into the ring and honestly, I don't quite know how the process went after that.
Speaker 2 00:06:44 It was kind of a black box, uh, which I guess is sort of appropriate for, for Jason Bourne, but several months went by and I just sort of assumed they decided to go another way. Uh, but then I got another call from my agent in, I think it was February of last year saying five words. I will remember for a long time, uh, Putnam wants you for born. And so I called the editor at Putnam to, to talk about my vision for, uh, how to take the series that, you know, was literally 40 years old and has had so many different iterations, you know, in books and in movies over the years and, and bring it into the modern era and kind of reboot and relaunch the whole series. And, uh, he, he loved kind of where I wanted to take it. And I developed a plot concept and wrote some chapters for the state to take a look at it. And they loved that. And, uh, so we were off to the races. That was how everything got started.
Speaker 1 00:07:41 So tell us a little bit about how you handle a franchise that, that old, I mean, it's Jason Bourne, just getting older. I haven't, I haven't read this one. I'm gonna read it.
Speaker 2 00:07:54 Yes. As I say it it's, it's 40 years old and the original book, the Bourne identity, uh, was coming out of the whole Vietnam Watergate era and born as a, as a hero has a lot of roots in Vietnam. Uh, and I, you know, writing a book featuring this character in 2020 yet that just wouldn't work unless, you know, you're planning on having, uh, you know, using a Walker and an oxygen tank. So I said, you know, I, I think what we really need to do is kind of go back to the drawing board and, and, and reboot the character and the series in, in modern times and not be tied to that original backstory. And instead, really try to get back to the, the elements that made Bourne, such an enduring, uh, iconic thriller hero. And so I really tried to go back to the roots of who this character was when Ludlam created him and, and carry that forward. And, and, you know, then reinvent this character in, in a, in a modern era.
Speaker 1 00:08:56 Of course we mentioned to say that, uh, Robert Ludlum died. It might be that no, not everybody knows that. Um, how long ago was it? He died?
Speaker 2 00:09:06 Uh, it was early, early two thousands. I came my first 2001, 2006.
Speaker 1 00:09:11 And then did he have some books in the hopper that they published prior to taking you on,
Speaker 2 00:09:16 You know, what, what happened was, uh, they, that was around the time that they had the Matt Damon movie franchise starting up. And I think that triggered a lot of new interest in Jason Bourne and they had, uh, Eric van Lewis bought her a longtime thriller writer. And I think a good friend of Ludlums who took over and wrote a number of Jason Bourne novels. And, uh, uh, I think, uh, uh, Eric decided he was sort of interested in retiring and, and Putnam took over and wanted to go a different way. So that was why they wanted to, to find someone new, to take over the series.
Speaker 1 00:09:49 And do you, did, did you have to study them, or did you read all the books and sort of go back and really pass them out and get a real sense of what his style was?
Speaker 2 00:09:59 I, I had, uh, I had obviously read the Loveland books, you know, many times over the years. I I've been a big fan for a long time. And, uh, I went back. The first thing I did when this possibility came up was go back and reread Ludlums Bourne books to really get a feel for the nature of the character and, and what he was trying to do and, and paid particular attention to the Bourne identity. Cause I feel like that was the, that was sort of a core book in which, uh, this, this character came to life. And so, yeah, I spent a lot of time looking at how he structured this character and who this character was. And, and I think that people that know Jason Bourne primarily through the, the Matt Damon movies may have kind of a different idea of born than you'll find in, in Ludlums books.
Speaker 2 00:10:43 I think that, uh, the movies sort of portray him as a little bit more of this, you know, emotionless killer, um, sort of almost more of a superhero. And, uh, and that, that really was not how, um, how born comes to life on the pages of the level of novels. I mean, he's much more emotional fractured. Uh, the, the relationship he has with, uh, his, his, um, his wife Marie is really at the heart of the series. And those were the elements that I wanted to bring back. I want it to really humanize, born in, in my books and kind of get back to the, the, the elements that were so, um, you know, were so prominent in Loveland's version.
Speaker 1 00:11:22 Oh, I always thought that being a, um, a bond fan, I always thought that, um, Jason Bourne was like a, an American James Bond in some ways
Speaker 2 00:11:35 I think reputationally that's probably true. I mean, I think that in, in a lot of ways, borne has sort of the, the, the, the, the long standing, uh, in enduring quality of, of being the American hero in the same way that that bond does over in the UK. But, you know, obviously, uh, you know, a very different American versus British style. I mean, bond is, it's so much more sort of polished and, and, uh, and, and cultured. And, uh, and, and that's not boring. I mean, he's, he's, he's American, he's a little rougher edge. And, uh, and, and he really struggles with, uh, with his, his personality and his past, which obviously as someone who has lost his memory, I mean, he's, he's struggling with who he is and trying to understand his identity. And I think that's what makes him a really fascinating character to write.
Speaker 1 00:12:24 Well, we should probably, uh, keep following this as you, as you work on this and, uh, uh, have a show just, just about this, um, sometime, you know, a few months from now and, uh,
Speaker 2 00:12:35 Yeah, yeah, absolutely. In fact, I'm turning in the second of my born books this week, so I just am putting the finishing touches on it.
Speaker 1 00:12:41 Right. And they contracted two from you. Yeah.
Speaker 2 00:12:45 And it looks like there'll be going back and doing a couple more after that too. Right.
Speaker 1 00:12:49 So it's just wonderful. So good. Um, all right. So I started reading all the other stuff. I couldn't read everything, but deep, deep snow was just fantastic.
Speaker 2 00:13:01 I've had readers say that too, that, uh, you know, I I'm, I'm writing so fast that they're falling behind,
Speaker 1 00:13:07 You know, I do have you on for most of the books. And I think the deep, deep snow is the only one I've missed recently. Um, and we always have a good time with this, but I, I, you, why don't you tell the listeners a little bit about the snow and then we'll focus on the funeral for a friend. Yeah.
Speaker 2 00:13:25 Th the deep deep snow came out as an audible original last year. So it was an audio book exclusive. Um, and, uh, uh, it, it was a fascinating creative experience for me in a lot of ways. First of all, writing, knowing that the book was going straight to audio, I was a different creative process writing something that you knew people were going to be listening to rather than reading. And this was the first mystery that I'd written. That was not only in the first person, uh, but also in, in a female voice. And, uh, and, and so it is, it's not really a thriller in the way. Many of my other books are thrillers. It's really more of a, a pure mystery. And I love the, the young Sheriff's deputy Shelby Lake, who is at the heart of this. Uh, she's, she's got a great narrative voice, uh, but I really had to work hard to get her to open up to me.
Speaker 2 00:14:20 It's, it's really interesting experience writing in the first person and, uh, and, and feeling as if Shelby had to kind of reach a level of trust with me as a writer in, in telling her story. And I felt like initially in the manuscript, she was kind of holding things back from me. And it took a little while before she began to reveal some of the secrets that I didn't necessarily know about her when I started the book. So I, it was, uh, it was a very interesting creative experience to write, and it's an extremely, uh, intense story. Um, I, it, it may be my favorite book of anything I've written. I really love the deep, deep snow, and I did something I'd never, uh, I've never done before I recently, I listened to the full audio edition of the book. It's voiced by a wonderful actress named, uh, January Levoy. And, uh, typically I never listened to the audio additions of my books. Cause I hear the pros in my head in a certain way. And it kind of drives me crazy when I hear somebody else doing it. But my gosh, I was so impressed.
Speaker 1 00:15:26 Yeah. So, I mean, it was funny. I started looking at that and thought, I'm not gonna have time to finish it before I have to get onto the funeral for a friend, but it really did catch me. And, uh, I loved the owl, got a love story that has an owl in it. Very, very good. So would you like to read a little bit from funeral for a friend? And we'll talk about that, which is, um, the book that's, uh, on, on stage right now.
Speaker 2 00:15:50 Yes. Funeral for a friend is my latest dilute based Jonathan stride novel. So this will give you a little taste of, uh, of the book. Stride stood on a cliff of black granite, 60 feet over a raging river, the fullness of the summer forest surrounded him. He knew this place. Well, it was called the deeps where Amedee Creek stampeded along seven bridges road, like a wild Mustang, swirling in whirlpools and sucking tree limbs into its current before spitting them out in the cold water of Lake superior. From this cliff, you could take a running leap into the water and swim in the black pool below. He'd done it himself. Dozens of times as a teenager, he and his best friend, Steve Gorsky would shout, jump, fly through the air, crash into the water and fight the undertow back to the surface over and over. But sometimes when the rains were heavy, the deeps caught a body and didn't give it back.
Speaker 2 00:16:52 Sometimes the flooded river held a body down and fed it to the Lake stride, stared into the Rapids, which boomed like deep rolls of thunder and erupted in silver waterfalls. He was right on the Cliff's edge, where the spray made the stones slippery don't fall. A voice said, stride turned around don't fall. They'll never find you. A man stood behind him. He was short no more than five foot six with a skinny build. He had finning black hair and wide staring eyes that looked like the mask of a raccoon. His skin was pale. His hair and clothes were soaking wet. He'd been diving into the swollen Creek, drip, drip, drip stride heard the noise in his head again, somehow louder than the violence of the river below him, but it wasn't water. He heard the man on the cliff had a bullet hole in the middle of his high forehead, a perfectly circular black ringed wound that seeped a ribbon of blood down the man's nose around his pale lips and onto his chin where it dripped onto the stone like chamber music, blood.
Speaker 2 00:18:07 That was what he'd heard all along. Blood strides, right hand felt heavy. He lifted it and saw that a gun was in his hand, a wisp of smoke trailing from the barrel, a burnt smell in the air. He shot this man in the head. The wound was right there in his forehead, but the man still had his eyes open. Still had a strange smile on his lips. Your dead stride told the man the smile on the man's face, widened and turned into a mocking cruel laugh that went on and on. You have to be dead stride insisted I shot you, but the man raised his arm and extended a bony brittle finger at strides. Chest stride looked down, his own shirt was soaked in blood, fresh cherry, red blood, growing and spreading into a misshapen stain, a mass of blood, the kind of loss, no one should survive. And there was a bullet hole in his own chest ripped through the fabric, right where his heart was. No, the man told him still laughing. You're the one who's dead.
Speaker 1 00:19:23 Very good, very dramatic, very Sturm UND. Drang going there. Wonderful stuff. So that's the opening to the book. There's it's just,
Speaker 2 00:19:32 And, and it, it will probably come as no shock that that's, that's a dream sequence there. Yes.
Speaker 1 00:19:37 It takes a while to get it into dream because you hide that a little bit in that. Yes. So, uh, let's talk about dreams. Um, you, you, you, you start that out with a dream. And, uh, it's interesting to me when we look at dreams and we think of fiction and think of how we develop our fiction from dreams, when you ride a dream, it's, it's, it's kind of like an UN a suburb of fiction, isn't it?
Speaker 2 00:20:07 Yeah. And honestly, I have always found that, that my dreams, uh, are very kind of parallel to the way I write my books, because the odd thing in my dreams is I am constantly shifting characters and perspectives. When I dream, I will go from one character to another and, and I, I may start out in one person in the dream and then suddenly I'm, I'm someone completely different inside the same dream. And that's honestly the way I kind of approach my pros as well. I'm looking at the world from multiple perspectives and, and that's very true in the story.
Speaker 1 00:20:43 Well, this one, you certainly, you, you, you resurrect all your old, all his old girls everybody's resurrected and you bring them all back and fit them together. And he doesn't get quite as much stage time as is I'm used to with, with, with him.
Speaker 2 00:20:59 That's true. He's a little bit more of a supporting character. And I think that's partly as the Siri has series has evolved and more characters have really kind of have taken center stage. I think that that stride has led some of the other characters, uh, you know, share that, that platform with him. Um, but you know, I'm always, when I'm designing a new stride novel, I'm always looking at what's going on in the lives of the series characters, sort of what's next for them. And, and I went all the way back to their very first book, uh, immoral this time around. And I, I, I remembered that, um, stride had had a very, uh, misbegotten marriage, a second marriage, uh, in immoral to a woman named Andrea. And I'd never gone back to Andrea again in the series, uh, you know, nine more books and, and I'd done nothing with, uh, with Andrea again. And I felt like that was just a, uh, a storyline that was sort of sitting there open and needed to be resolved. And, and so it just seemed to fit perfectly to, to bring Andrea back in, in funeral for a friend and deal with the ramifications of, of kind of how that marriage fell apart.
Speaker 1 00:22:03 Mm, no, I think that's very effective. I liked that a lot, all the books, all the books, a little bit different every time, every time you do one, you, you seem to bring in some sort of current affair. I think we talked about this last time, um, in various ways, and, and here, you know, you've got dead, dead beat reporters and CZ politicians rape and, and a lot of internet connection here. Um, is, is this more than you've done before in terms of the current additions of things?
Speaker 2 00:22:36 I think it's very much in line with how I've approached some of the recent stride books. I think they do kind of have a, a little bit of a ripped from the headlines, a feel to them. Uh, the previous stride book was alter ego and alter ego dealt with, uh, a film being made in Duluth of one of strides cases and the great theater that, yeah, and the actor that was playing stride, uh, had, uh, some very, some very dark secrets. Uh, and, and that book, I actually turned it in two weeks before the whole Harvey Weinstein thing hit in the press. So it, it, uh, people were asking, you know, did I know something? And it's like, well, no, this isn't this case. It was, it was just a coincidence that, uh, it, it sort of became the first thriller of the me too generation.
Speaker 2 00:23:20 Uh, but in, in funeral for a friend, I, I definitely was inspired by a lot of the, the, the storylines and the headlines. And, and when you look at the politician in funeral for a friend and this story of, you know, sexual misconduct going all the way back to his, his, uh, college days, uh, obviously you can't help, but think of, of, you know, the whole, uh, the whole Kavanaugh issue and all the things that went out. And, and so I was, I was inspired by that and, and sort of wove that into the concept of the plot, with the idea of, of kind of exploring all sorts of, um, you know, different puzzles and secrets and issues of, of, of memory and how, you know, all these, you're kind of dealing with the question of, you know, when all that time has passed, can you ever really find the truth?
Speaker 1 00:24:05 Yeah. And of course, you, uh, you get into that old trope, which is, which never seems to get old. And that is that the main character of the cop, uh, becomes a suspect.
Speaker 2 00:24:18 Yes, yes. The via for the first time, it seems like stride actually crossed a line, you know, this, this very, very honorable man, uh, uh, sort of, sort of did something that he, he really, uh, should not have done, but if strides going to, if strides going to cross, uh, the wrong line then, and then chances are, he's trying to protect someone.
Speaker 1 00:24:39 It's so interesting because he has kind of come close before in some of the other books, like, like a lot of these sorts of characters. He, he's not always a good boy, is he?
Speaker 2 00:24:51 Well, and particularly if you go back again, all the way to the very first book in, in immoral, uh, the, the, the, the, one of the things that stride particularly, uh, did, did wrong without going into any details or spoilers of course, was actually back in, in immoral. So, uh, and so things kind of come full circle a little bit in this book.
Speaker 1 00:25:08 So, you know, as you, as you talk about all of these books, going back to the beginning, you know, I, I wonder what COVID, and, um, the situation that we're in right now is doing to your readership, are they rereading your books? Are they going back and reading the, the first ones? I, I know you've called for, uh, communication with your readers, and I've seen that. I think that's very generous of you because that could end up being a lot of time. Um, tell me a little bit about your experience with that as an author.
Speaker 2 00:25:44 Yeah. I have definitely found that this year, I find, I mean, I found, first of all, that I think a lot more people have rediscovered reading generally. I mean, a lot of people have found the books this year because they they're staying home more. They have more time they're looking for, for different forms of entertainment and, and they're, they're looking to the books, but it's just, as you say, I've, I've heard from so many readers now that have been going back to, to rediscover the books, starting at the beginning of the series and, and reading their way forward again. So, uh, that has been, uh, I think a really, uh, a really positive thing in, in, in an otherwise difficult year. Uh, and, uh, I, you know, I think that, you know, having to, to not do in-person events, one at least positive is by doing all sorts of virtual events, which, which we've been doing, um, it actually gives us a chance to reach out to readers who are not geographically close. I mean, normally if I'm doing events, it's going to be, you know, in the upper Midwest, well now doing zoom happy hours and zoom, bookstore offense, and things like that, I can, I can invite and bring in readers from
Speaker 1 00:26:44 Places I otherwise never would have had a chance to visit and connect with them. And I think that is, that's a good thing. And that's likely to, to live on well past the, uh, the COVID day. I hope it does because it's lovely seeing you on zoom here, you know, it's, you can't be in right here in the studio with us, but here's your face sitting up there. So, uh, we're of course run out of time, but let's, uh, let's come on again and have a, uh, a deeper talk about the, the Bourne evolution and, um, you know, do that in a couple of months and see how we go with all of that. And, um, I just wish you all the best of luck you are just the hardest worker and you are such a nice man, and you've got a good heart and you put these things out and I really respect what you do and, uh, you know, good luck to you. Well, thank you. I really appreciate it. It was great talking to you again, and thanks for being on the show. Again, you were talking, you were listening to me and great Graham Lee speaking with Brian Freeman about funeral for a friend and the deep, deep snow and the born evolution. So you again soon, Brian bye-bye bye-bye and now this,
Speaker 3 00:27:57 Hi, all this is Annie, uh, with right on radio. I'm very excited to be here with you guys. Um, unfortunately our guest has not called in for this show yet. Um, so for now, I'll just introduce the book a little bit, a little more about what it's about. Um, I'll be interviewing Mindy grayling, the author of fix what you can, um, a memoir about, um, schizophrenia and, um, a month, particularly a mother's experience, um, with her son having, uh, having our son have schizophrenia become onset in his twenties, and then attempting to help him both in her role as a mother and in her role as a lawmaker, um, both by helping him find career opportunities. And, uh, also by trying to pass legislature that would help protect him in the future. Um, I'm going to throw on some theme music, chill out, rote, sit back, relax. Uh, wait a couple minutes. Um, hopefully she'll be here very soon. Thank you.
Speaker 0 00:29:12 <inaudible>
Speaker 3 00:30:37 Hi, uh, this is Annie, uh, your optimistic, but also realistic host here on, right on radio on KFA 90.3 FM. Um, since I am not sure if our guest is coming, perhaps she has a family emergency, perhaps she has a snow emergency. Um, I'm still hanging here in the studio. We're practicing social distancing. We've got screens up. We're taking all the precautions. I'm here with my wonderful friend and KFH mentor Liz olds. And we're just going to have a little chat while we wait and see if she shows up, uh, Liz, what have you been reading and writing lately?
Speaker 4 00:31:15 What have I been reading? Well, I've been reading a lot of books right on radio. The main one that I've been reading right now is a book called a hymns of the Republic. And it's a book about the last year of the civil war. Uh, very, uh, interesting to me, cause I'm a civil war buff. He should, uh, see my books, my wall books about the civil war. I didn't have I ever showed you a picture of that? No, I
Speaker 3 00:31:42 Seeing pictures of your cats. So I'm sure I'd like to see pictures of your
Speaker 4 00:31:47 Yeah. So, um, so that is very interesting to me. And it'll be a fun interview. It's I can't remember what if it's on the, no, let's see leaves on the 17th 24th. I think it's on the eighth of, uh, December, but I'm not positive, but anyway, we got lots of interviews. So if you happen to tune in on the 8th of December, you wouldn't be disappointed. Um, so, uh, that's what I'm reading his books, right? Or radio, what I'm writing is I'm doing this, uh, 12 show series about songs of Broadway. Yeah. I'm working on the script for that. I was trying to record the first episode today. Again, I've recorded about three times and have had technical difficulties and we had technical difficulties again today. Cause there's only one CD player, the, uh, recording studio that works. So, uh, but writing yet, I've had to do a lot of research and I have learned many, many things, uh, uh, writing this, uh, uh, uh, series.
Speaker 4 00:32:53 Uh, I'm trying to think of one that I can share with you, but I'm, I'm not, uh, bringing one up to mind right at the moment. Uh, I will, Oh, I know one, uh, uh, the, uh, theme to Oklahoma was not, uh, a medley of Orca, an orchestral med orchestral medley of songs from the show. It was just simply, uh, an empty stage with, uh, a woman churning butter and the middle of the stage, and then curly the, the, uh, um, the male lead comes on singing. Oh, what a beautiful morning. And, uh, it was quite surprising. It shocked the critics on the audience, uh, uh, because they're used to, um, theme songs, you know, big orchestral things. And so this was different. Oklahoma's also considered to be the beginning of the golden age of, of music of musicals because, uh, it, uh, it had a story it's called the book musical.
Speaker 4 00:33:58 It had a story rather than a pile of songs that aren't connected really in any way to each other. This had a real story and the songs were connected. Also, Oklahoma is actually, uh, uh, saw, uh, uh, needs call about, uh, one of the characters is a guy who, uh, is a rapist and there's a murder and there's, uh, he has, uh, pornographic postcards and there's all this stuff in Oklahoma that never, never anybody would think because they think it's just this, you know, uplifting, uh, uh, musical edit is, but Rogers and Hammerstein, uh, really did, uh, like in the Kagan IQ, they, they took on certain, uh, issues of the day, you know, uh, segregation and, um, um, murder and, you know, things mostly, um, um, issues of the, uh, it's kind of like the same issues we're dealing with today. Uh, racial injustice, South Pacific is full of, uh, of ideas about racial justice. There's a saga there called you've got to be carefully taught, which is about, um, um, the fact that, you know, you're not born a racist, you have to be taught to be a racist. And, and that song was very controversial and, uh, in some, uh, productions that was left out and, and other protections it was kept in. So anyway, that's my story about what I'm working on, as you can tell, I'm excited about it. Do you
Speaker 3 00:35:38 Think Liz that the, um, the idea of kind of a book forward musical, rather than a song's first musical opened up the opportunity to like, make a musical that's more like focused on a social issue or focused on a cultural issue? Or do you think that those things just kind of coincided in public art?
Speaker 4 00:35:59 No, I think, uh, uh, the first, um, I think that, um, the, once they, they had musicals that were just reviewed, you know, of songs, they didn't fit together at all. They were just kind of, you know, songs. And then, uh, this concept of a book musical, which started with Oklahoma, um, brought the ability to tell when you're telling stories, you, uh, can approach those issues differently than if you're just singing a song about it, you know? And, um, again, South Pacific was pretty amazing show in terms of, uh, issues around racism and xenophobia and stuff like that. So, uh, it, and the story left room for that. And so, um, I think, you know, you're right. I think that, uh, once musicals were doing stories, West side story is another one, you know, it's about, certainly about, um, racial issues. Um, and, uh, it doing these story musicals definitely opened up the concept of, of talking about, um, issues of the day. Cool.
Speaker 3 00:37:21 Do you have any, um, I know you've been doing pretty extensive research reading, listening for this podcast. Do you have any recommendations for someone who's interested in, um, kind of the origin or the sort of history of the book forward musical could look into
Speaker 4 00:37:40 Boy, there's a lot of books that I read and I can't remember the title, but, you know, if you, if you, uh, go to Google or search engine and search private musicals, and then a bunch of stuff will come up and, and the books, um, the books will come up there, they're mostly, uh, titles like, uh, uh, the Broadway musical, blah, you know, and, you know, and some of these stories are just amazing and West, it's kind of like the civil war in a sense that you, once you've read a bunch of books about the civil war, the same stories keep cropping up. Yeah. And it's the same way with broad musical. So you read four or five books in the same story as keep cropping up, you know, and, and, uh, so I'm afraid I don't have titles, but
Speaker 3 00:38:29 That's okay. That's okay for, for being on the spot. I think you're giving great analysis. Thank you for of you listening at home. Um, if you have internet available to you, um, on kfi.org, you can listen to Liz's other podcast, um, the Broadway project for free, it's just there on the site and you can listen to it. Um, it has premiered, so that's something cool. Great.
Speaker 4 00:38:52 Actually, it hasn't yet it hasn't premiered yet. We're having all these things, technical difficulties. I tried to record it at home at my home studio and the Volk, the narration sounded awful. And then I tried to, uh, uh, input my CDs or my music, uh, to the, through the computer on the Hindenburg. And that sound was awful. So I came in here to do some recording in the, our production studio, and we only have one CD player and, you know, it's just, I'm going crazy. We'll get it up there eventually. I have, I have no doubt.
Speaker 3 00:39:30 Yeah. If you, if you didn't donate during the last member drive, you can, uh, think about that for the future. Because, uh, as those of us here in the studio know, this is truly all in community radio. Most of us are not getting paid to be here, and we're doing this on a volunteer basis because it enrich our lives in some ways. Um, a lot of us make our shows and podcasts using equipment in the studio that we wouldn't be able to afford, have space for, or both otherwise in our own homes. Um, and it's really a wonderful institution. And you can tell from the variety of programming available on cafe in numerous languages and on numerous topics that, um, it really opens up options for people, um, to have a creative output that other people are going to interact with. So what are you working on? And I personally just wrapped up a couple book reviews that I submitted to local magazines, not yet to be named.
Speaker 4 00:40:28 Um, I
Speaker 3 00:40:30 Reviewed a couple books that, um, I was really excited about this year. Um, one is milk blood heat by Dontell Mona's, um, who's a fabulous first book author who writes in Florida about Florida. Um, and it's a really cool collection of stories that take place in a shared world in Florida. And, um, I think they're just remarkable stories because they take the same scene, um, look at it from very different ages, social demographics, um, viewpoints. And I just think that, um, I want to, I usually want to write a review because I love the book. I've never, I've never read a book that I hate and thought, Oh, I want to write a smash of this. I always wanna, I always wanna dig into the details of what I think makes the book important and what someone could get out of it so that if they read the review and it speaks to them, that's great.
Speaker 3 00:41:23 And they can go look for that book and pick it up. Um, and I really liked milk blood heat, both because of the perspective it brought and because there are romantic relationships in the book that are great and not so great, but it's so much a book about friendship, like the first story, which is the title, the titular story, as I hate to say. Um, and it is about this friendship between two young girls who, um, one is white, one is black, um, and the white girl meets an untimely young, deaf, um, and the black girl kind of lives with the consequences and it discusses the ways that they're the same, but also the ways that society views them very differently in ways that I thought were really eloquent and really well done and really shown rather than told. Um, and I'm just very excited about this book and I can't wait for, uh, people to read it.
Speaker 3 00:42:15 Um, I'm trying to work myself back into more of a routine of writing fiction. So I'll set aside time and just let myself, right. I'll just let myself like throw the silly string. Um, so I don't really know what's coming of that, but it's something that I haven't been able to do for awhile. Um, and it's nice to be able to pick that up. That's always a relationship that I've had with drawing, but I haven't had as much with writing. So it's been very nice to Kindle that back and like everyone on this show, I'm reading constantly for this show and also sending, uh, sending galley requests for those of you who are either new listeners or aren't aware, we send all of our own book, copy requests, develop relationships with publicists completely on our own. Um, write our own interviews, produce our own interviews.
Speaker 3 00:43:04 When I prerecord something, I spend painstaking amounts of time, like going in with a metaphorical tweezer and taking out all of my ums and pauses. Um, so that's actually been a really nice thing to have during the pandemic and the quarantine that I can, uh, spend my time doing something that, um, I find really enjoyable and fulfilling. And then I have, um, Josh, Liz, Dave, Ian, et cetera, um, to really encourage me and hold me accountable as I go through this. Um, I hope to someday go, go full podcast, uh, the way Liz is. But, uh, for now it's really great to have this communal show that we can, uh, together write on and record on. Um, and if you're out there and you're an author and you'd be interested in having your book on the show, um, we do have contact information on kfa.org, uh, where you can pitch us. Uh, you can go, you can go direct to us. You don't have to go to some KFH at sitting in someone's empty inbox, forever.org. You can go directly to us. So,
Speaker 4 00:44:08 And I just want to repeat something we said in the calendar, which is I'm trying to get more items for the calendar. Um, sometimes, sometimes rain taxi has a ton of items, but sometimes they only have one or two and I'd like to have a longer calendar than that. And I'd also like to, uh, provide people with, uh, uh, outlet for their calendar items. So I'm going to give you that, um, email address a couple more times here. So grab a pen it's w O R calendar
[email protected]. Now items has an S on the end. So it's w O R calendar
[email protected]. And please send us your, uh, your events and have the info to me by Monday the day before the show, because that's when I do the calendar and, you know, please send us your invest because we just want to get the word out about writing things and things, places where people can go to hear people read or to learn about writing or whatever. So, uh, send us those events.
Speaker 3 00:45:17 Yeah. Uh, to piggyback off what Liz is saying. Um, we here in the studio really want to, we were right with cafe eye on wanting to cultivate a creative community here in the twin cities. And not just to, not just to sit here on the top floor of the Bailey building in front of those fuzzy microphones and tell you what to read and what not to read. Um, we'd love to hear your we'd love to hear your thoughts and input and, uh, what you want to see and where you want to see us.
Speaker 5 00:45:53 Yes, this is
Speaker 4 00:45:57 I'll keep talking. Yes. Uh, we are, uh, unfortunately our guests did not make it today. Um, so we're kind of filling in with our, uh, ideas and your, um, freedom of writing. I was talking to my writing coach. Uh, yesterday we talked about practice. We talked about the spiritual nature of writing for, you know, whatever it doesn't matter if you're, uh, uh, what your religious background is. The, uh, the spiritual aspect of writing is a great thing to realize the habit practice, to try to make it to your, uh, desk every day and put your butt down in the seat. Does they say, uh, it's um, I'm learning, I'm learning, you know, I, I, uh, sometimes the thing about this Broadway show thing is that, um, you know, I've been working on a memoir and it's hard and it's a slog. And you know what I mean, if you've written a memoir, even if you've thought about writing a memoir and writing this Broadway thing, it's a lot of fun. And I said to my writing coach yesterday, I don't feel like I'm writing because I'm having fun. And she said, Oh, no, Liz that's writing. You know, writing can be fun sometimes
Speaker 5 00:47:12 That's really wonderful.
Speaker 4 00:47:14 Yes, it is. It's, it's getting fun. And even the memoir is kind of, it's pushing its way to enjoy it.
Speaker 3 00:47:24 Um, I've, I've read Liz's memoir, just so everybody knows, but my lips are, uh, absolutely sealed until she is ready to share it with the world. Um, and just thank you everyone for listening tonight. Um, this has been right on radio, on KFA F M uh, and streaming live on the
[email protected]. Um, even though our host couldn't make it, maybe it's the weather, maybe it's something else who knows we'll catch her around some time. And it was really lovely to catch up with, um, dear, dear friend of the show and backbone of the show. Uh, Liz olds, um, stay tuned, uh, up next to you have Burnsville, Minnesota have a wonderful night.
Speaker 0 00:48:07 <inaudible>
Speaker 6 00:51:21 Fresh air community radio is K F a I 90.3, FM HD, Minneapolis st. Paul, online and
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