Speaker 0 00:00:00 <inaudible>
Speaker 1 00:01:17 You are listening to right on radio on cafe 90.3 FM and streaming live on the
[email protected]. I'm Josh Weber tonight, Liz olds, we talking with <inaudible> about his latest work. My last 8,000 days, glucan turns as no pad and tape record tape recorder, excuse me, inward taking his skills as an emerging journalist to perform a deep dive on himself here. He offers a memoir of his life as a journalist editor, husband, father, and Pittsburgh native recounted, not only as many trials, but also exposing his missteps and challenges. Then in the last part of the hour, Dave Fedak will be talking with Dan Henriksen author of comedy album, a collection of comedic absurdist poetry. And as he describes it, dust nonsense. Dan is the co-writer of the scrap adaption of did I ever thank you, sister and his previous collection of verse in verbiage, dark glasses, Dan lives in Minneapolis, all this and more. So stay tuned to write on radio. Hello Lee, are you there? Oh, great. Why don't you start with your rating
Speaker 0 00:02:46 On my way home from Starbucks that day.
Speaker 1 00:02:50 Okay.
Speaker 0 00:02:54 No more hesitation,
Speaker 1 00:02:57 Never again. And that helped
Speaker 2 00:03:00 Until I realized that what I had just said, I'd said out loud, I was talking to myself is if I were to people, which is okay, I guess lots of people talk to themselves, but not in public for God's sake, but this seems to happen more frequently. As I get older, for instance, I might leave Starbucks after having a casual conversation with someone in the coffee line, I say, goodbye, exit out the door. Then continue the conversation of wow. As I walk up the street, the sound of my voice, carrying both sides of the conversation eventually startles me. And I say also out loud, Oh, you better stop this. And I do until I begin to think of something else that's on my mind and my resolve to shut up fades. And the dialogue in my head gradually grows out of my mouth and into the street.
Speaker 2 00:03:55 And again, I have to shut myself up, stop talking. I command. And again, for God's sake, it's out loud. Sometimes I express in public out loud and for no particular reason and to know related reference 9 cents total nonsense, which sticks in my head for days on end, like the lyrics of a song you hear on the radio or has music on an elevator, which you cannot, as hard as you try shake that day after Tony was whisked away in an ambulance. As I was walking home, I said to no one, except maybe to the sidewalk where the storefronts on the street. Great. What do you think of mr. Skink now? Why did I say that? Who is mr. Skink, but this mr. Skink business, this became a noise in my head. I couldn't shake all day long during feverish runs and at home drinking glass after glass of wine before dinner and more after dinner alone at night, I repeatedly asked myself the question of the moment.
Speaker 2 00:05:02 What do you think of mr. Skiing? Asking myself the question after a few days? Yeah. The mr. Skink mystery, why he popped into my head has forever alluded me and he does come back to confusing time me from time to time. Maybe I know mr. Scape, and maybe I'm slipping. Maybe just a little, maybe, perhaps mr. Skink is me, but look, I don't want you to, or anyone to think that I was or am some sort of neurotic because honestly it's simply not true and, or not completely true anyway, but I have come to understand that there are two different and often conflicting Lee's first. There's the li who presents himself to the public. And I am one confident cat, or at least that's my personal or facade. I teach at a large university. I have no problem lecturing, hundreds of people during which time I am animated articulates and quite spontaneous.
Speaker 2 00:06:03 I've been on national TV various times, including good morning America and the daily show with Jon Stewart. And I do well also one-on-one I know how to listen to charm, to flirt and joke, even in difficult circumstances, all generally in a timely and responsive manner, but then alas, there's the other league, the behind the closed doors, me, another person and another persona entirely. Well, not that I get crazy when I am alone screaming and yelling and throwing things or punch out my TV when Wolf Blitzer or Oprah Winfrey get on my nerves. But, but, but when I am home and alone, especially when I'm preparing to go out and play the public, meet the pressure mounts and I become anxious. And more than a bit OCD, I guess I'm pretty damaged, secure, and the insecurity is, or was getting worse and more troublesome. As I got older, I became increasingly afraid of looking foolish, making mistakes, showing my age like I had with Tony. I worked hard ceaselessly and obsessively to prove to the world that I was a Superman, a guy who's got it all together quite naturally as if it was in my blood.
Speaker 3 00:07:27 Thanks Lee. We are listening to <inaudible> author of my last 8,000 days on American male in his seventies. Uh, welcome to right on radio.
Speaker 2 00:07:39 It's so nice to be here. How are you? I'm doing great. How are you? I'm doing pretty well. Uh, here I am here in Pittsburgh, my hometown, and it is quite cold, although probably not as cold as where you were.
Speaker 3 00:07:52 No, actually we are warmer than usual, but, um, yeah. Are you, uh, are you a pirate span? I wanted to ask you that during our interview,
Speaker 2 00:08:02 You know, I used to be a pirates fan and, and a baseball fan. You know, I wrote a book. I spent a year with the crew of national league baseball umpires. Um, it was my second book and I was a rabbit, uh, baseball fan and pirates fan. But now, um, if you follow baseball, um, baseball's kind of, um, fading away in some quarters and the pirates certainly have faded away as contenders. So I spoke, I spent a lot of time, like everybody else in Pittsburgh, we are obsessed with the Pittsburgh Steelers.
Speaker 3 00:08:35 They're doing pretty good. Well, let's talk about the book. Why don't you give us a brief idea of what the book is about?
Speaker 2 00:08:44 Uh, the book is about, uh, me, it's a memoir, um, and what happened to me more or less when I turned 70 years old and you know, I, um, um, I've done a lot of books before. Uh, mostly, almost all except for this one, um, is our immersion books. And what I mean by immersion is that, um, I spend tons of time, years, uh, interacting and becoming a part of other people's lives. Um, and I've done that, not just with baseball umpires, but with, um, organ transplant, surgeons and veterinarians and a child, psych psychiatrist. I've spent lots of time doing that. And then as, um, and it's very, it's, it's, it's very time consuming, but then, um, the year upcoming to my 70th birthday, um, a couple of a number of things kind of happened to me that kind of made me rethink what I wanted to do.
Speaker 2 00:09:43 Uh, as far as the book next for one thing, my two best friends died that year. Um, and, um, um, five days before my 70th birthday, uh, my mom who was 94 years old and certainly my all-time best friend, um, died. And, uh, I had a relationship that, uh, that had lasted 10 years and that ended that year. And I also had a book that I thought was I was working on a book that I thought was going to be the book of my life. I mean, the crowning glory of my literary career and that year, the book fell apart as well. And I, I, um, I felt really abandoned and alone and Liz, you know, that, um, writers spend tons of time with themselves and all alone, and we're pretty much loners in many respects. And so there I was, um, with, with, uh, with notebook and, um, and no support system whatsoever with my friends and my mom died and my girlfriend gone and I felt lost and I didn't know what to do.
Speaker 2 00:10:51 And so, um, but I wanted to keep writing. And so I decided that here I am, this crack immersion writer, who's written so many books about other people's lives that I needed to kind of a way to understand my own life. What had happened to me in the 50 years before that I was writing and, um, and, and assess the decisions I had made and the friends I had lost. And so I decided to immerse myself to take a deep dive into my life and kind of figure out what had happened there. I was a six or a fairly successful writer, the editor of a well-known magazine, a full professor at a large university, and I was lost. I didn't know what to do. And so, um, what I did was dive into my own life and that's what the book is pretty much all about.
Speaker 2 00:11:44 It's about, um, how to catch up with yourself, how to figure out, um, what you've done. That's good and what you've done. That's not so good and how to make a transition into a future that will at 70 years old or would at 70 years old, uh, kind of make the last part of my life. As many of this 8,000 days, I have left more satisfying and, and, uh, and more helpful to me, um, so that I could understand myself and make a transition. So that's what the book is about. And, and, um, as all good, all good creative nonfiction books are it's somebody's life mine, but it also has a subtopic, a, uh, a theme over, over overwhelming my own story. And that theme was the whole challenge for me. It's 70, and now I'm 77, but for me, it's 70. And for all those baby boomers, all 70 million of us who, um, who also may feel a little lost and, and a little picked on because it's not good. It's not a good thing in some respects to be old these days. Um, people kind of discount you, and I did not want anyone to discount me. I wanted to keep on working and I wanted to, to, to stay as productive as I could for the rest of my life. And so it's about my life, but it's also about the challenges of getting old and aging and, and how you deal with it.
Speaker 3 00:13:19 Uh, kind of to that idea, uh, you mentioned, and many people have said this to me, I turned 60 a few years ago, and many people said to me, Oh, age is just the number. And I didn't feel that way. I felt like, uh, you know, this landmark birthday was important. And I'm wondering, you seemed a little ambivalent, like on the one hand and just, just the number on the other hand, it was an important milestone. And I'm wondering if you could talk a little bit about that.
Speaker 2 00:13:47 Wow. Well, when I was 40 years old, I got, I've had this aging problem for a long time. Um, of course I had age, but I had this problem of being afraid that people would, um, would not respond to me. Um, in, in the way I was used to them responding to me, uh, as I got older. So I did the dumbest thing I can imagine doing now. And that is, um, when I turned 40, I, uh, I wrote emails. I wrote, uh, letters and make phone calls to all of the people I knew who were friends of mine or family, uh, and ask them to, from that point on, ignore my birthday, don't send me cards, don't send me letters, don't make phone calls. Uh, um, uh, just, uh, just, just forget me. I want my, I want every year, January 3rd to go by, like January 2nd and, uh, February 8th.
Speaker 2 00:14:41 Um, that's what I wanted and it was stupid. And, and, um, and as the years went by, I continued to insist foolishly also. And it was a pretty, my January 3rd was the loneliest day of my year because nobody paid attention to it. So, um, but as when I hit 70, I started to admit to my age and, um, uh, which was part of this deep dive. Uh, you, you have to come to terms with who you are, how old you are. And, um, and, and so, uh, hiding my age for so long, lying about my age, if you would, if you, if you Google me and, and you look at some of my biographies, you will see that, um, I'm different ages because I lied about it constantly. So it, my 70th was really interesting and it was the first time that I, that I kind of celebrated it cautiously, um, with other people,
Speaker 3 00:15:43 Uh, talk to them. I think one of the hardest things about aging, at least I have noticed this a little bit myself at my young age, but also I remember my father, he died when he was 90 and he spent the last couple of years of his life being quite lonely because most of his friends had gone on before him. And I'm, I'm, you know, if you could talk about what that means in terms of the aging process, losing people and, and how that affects, uh, one in terms of their loneliness.
Speaker 2 00:16:12 Well, of course, um, uh, the phone doesn't ring, as you get older, the phone doesn't ring as much as it once did. And, um, and some of your, uh, uh, top or regular social life has to do with people dying, going to the funerals. Um, and, and, um, you're, and it's very, very difficult as you get older, 65, 70, 75, 80. It is really difficult to find new friends. Your old friends are sliding away. As I said, my best friends died, uh, when I was 70 or right the year before I was 70 and suddenly you're really, um, feeling all alone. And so for me as a writer, um, who lives a lonely life anyway, uh, to suddenly not have a support system, it was really difficult. And so one of the things in my book is my book starts with, with, with all of the problems I was facing, um, and mostly insecurity about being old, being 70.
Speaker 2 00:17:15 And then I go back in time a little bit and, and dig into my life from the time I was 18 and, um, and kind of followed my, uh, my, my career or my life and, and, uh, my personal life all the way up, back to 70. And then I decided the book make, takes a turn as, as, as a book, as good book should. And, uh, I began to, uh, to not only knowledge my birthday and celebrate it either, uh, um, um, uh, each year that went by, but I began to take pride to make the 10 transition, to work as hard as I worked as a writer to work as that hard in making new friends. And maybe those new friends were 50 instead of 70. Um, but, um, but I really made the transition and decided to work as hard as possible and do everything I could to, um, to, uh, to find a new world and a new life with new people, um, that, um, that would make me help me feel young and, and keep me productive.
Speaker 2 00:18:21 And I should say also, um, I've got this thing, um, um, the, the way in which society treats older people, um, really bothers me. Um, it's like, um, sometimes you walk up the street somewhere or, and people it's, it's almost as if people look through you rather than at you anymore at when you get to a certain age when, when there's too much gray hair instead of red or Brown hair. And when, uh, the wrinkles are all over your face. And, and maybe also when, uh, you walk a little bit slower and you have to think a little bit longer to figure out what word you want to use. And, um, and, and, and, and the certain ways that people treat you, like, I can't tell you how many times it just so annoys me, but how many times people that I know and, and meet or meet people, ask me if I'm retired, or if not, when I'm going to retire.
Speaker 2 00:19:20 And it's quite annoying, um, why assume that I'm going to hang up my skates and sit in a lawn chair and soak in the sun. Um, and, and, and as they say, smell the roses, why can't they assume that I'm going to go forward and, and be as productive as possible and as active as possible for the rest of my life? Um, so that's, so I have been fighting back. Um, um, sometimes I know that this might happen to other people like me, but you'll walk into us a store. Um, um, and, and, and you'll be greeted in a friendly, gracious matter, but they'll say to you, how are you today? Young man? Well, I'm not young, I'm 70 years old. And, um, it just makes me feel so bad that I know what they're doing. They're, they're, they're indirectly telling me that I'm old. And, uh, and they're trying to make me feel better about it. Well, I don't have to feel better about it. Um, um, I need to be able to feel better about it because of me and not because of them. So I've been fighting this, this, this prejudiced, uh, as a, um, uh, about, uh, uh, directed to people who, who look old, because just because you look hold, it doesn't look old, it doesn't mean you think old, or you act old
Speaker 3 00:20:41 Well thinking of that and not being retired, talk some about creative non-fiction in the magazine, how, how you got to start it, it's kind of your baby. I know. And then you got it started and where it's going from now.
Speaker 2 00:20:54 Well, um, uh, we're on our 27th year and, and, and yes, it was, uh, started as a literary journal in 1993. And I did it because, uh, I started it because there were so many people, um, uh, so many people writing this, it creative non-fiction is, uh, is a, an, a, an amalgam of style and substance. And just like I just told you about my book, it's about me, but it's also about something else, uh, aging. And, uh, so most of the best creative non-fiction, uh, the word creative, non the words are creative non-fiction meaning that, um, there's a non-fiction part and information part, an idea, part, a reflection part, but also, um, framing, uh, the information and ideas you want to communicate to your reader also, um, there's a story part, and the story pretty much frames, the information that you, an information could be about your family, and it could be about your profession, whatever it is.
Speaker 2 00:22:02 And so, um, there were, um, there w there was a great resistance to this idea of creative non-fiction journalists hated the word creative, because they thought that that meant you were making stuff up. And in the Academy, in every writing program, across the United States, uh, nonfiction was not considered to be an art form like poetry and, and, and infection. Um, uh, they were always asking me and I started teaching at the university of Pittsburgh in the seventies, right after I wrote a book about traveling around the country in a motorcycle. And, and, and after that, um, I was put on at the university of Pittsburgh as a part-time instructor and move my way forward. But, um, but no one really wanted to teach non-fiction because it wasn't an art, it wasn't literary, it was more like a craft. So many of my colleagues would, would refer to journalism as plumbing, something like plumbing or, or putting together an engineering project.
Speaker 2 00:23:07 Um, but I knew, and lots of other people knew that this stuff has been going on this creative non-fiction the synchronistic synchronization between style and substance. It had been going on for not just 10 years, not just 20 years, 10 years before, uh, in the early 1970s, Tom Wolf began, uh, um, talking about new journalism and new journalism, um, was part of this creative nonfiction, but there were also, um, uh, Daniel Defoe, Mark Twain, Charles Dickens, they were amalgam, they were moving, they were putting fact and story together. And in fact, um, uh, Defoe and Dixons started their life as journalists and not as, um, not as novelist. And so when I got a chance at the university of Pittsburgh, um, um, to start, uh, to, to teach, um, uh, I had a lot of resistance from the, from the literature, people from the composition people and from the writing people, um, who just didn't want to have to open up the doors to this other genre.
Speaker 2 00:24:16 And, um, but I, I, and I fought, I really did fight and got a number of new journalism or non new non-fiction courses, introduced it in the writing program. At that time, the university of Pittsburgh was the largest writing program in the United States, and it became incredibly popular, um, act Pitt. And, um, but it was a fight all the way. I was constantly dueling with my colleagues, uh, to get them to understand that this Sean rhe was as old as fiction in many respects. And I, how do you do that? How do you convince a conservative? Um, and, um, and, and maybe limited from the outside world scholars to accept of this genre and that's, and I used to go into their offices and I saw they had tons of journals, literary journals and journals about whatever they were interested in. And then my idea was, okay, I am going to create a literary journal.
Speaker 2 00:25:20 Um, um, and I'm going to limit it only to creative nonfiction, no poetry, no, no, no, um, no, no fiction. Um, and, and it kind of opened up, um, it opened up a flood gate of people coming to us, creative. Non-fiction sending their work and saying, no one would accept this work anymore. It before. Uh, there's no place for me to put my work, unless, unless I'm really good and famous, and I can get an Esquire or Harper's, or the new Yorker. And so this kind of opened up the door for people who were writing this stuff and not knowing what to do with it. And in fact, not even knowing, um, what, um, how to even define it. And so I started the literary journal and, uh, and, and, um, I think anyone would say looking back at the genre, uh, the history of the genre that w that the literary journal made creative non-fiction, um, made in the Academy, made it kind of official.
Speaker 2 00:26:25 It kind of made it something that, that, that fit in with the other literary models and courses that they talked. And so very soon more literary journals, there were no other literary journals except one or two that would accept creative nonfiction, but very soon we have, we did so very well. Um, um, our readership grew immensely and very soon other literary journals started to, um, to, uh, ask for submissions of creative nonfiction. And the courses at Pitt grew more popular and more and more, um, um, uh, English departments all across this country and in the UK and New Zealand and in Australia began offering courses like, like this, all of which, uh, were, were much more profitable than almost any of the other courses they had.
Speaker 3 00:27:19 So creative non-fiction kind of exploded then and became a wonderful thing.
Speaker 2 00:27:24 It's the fastest growing genre now, um, um, in the publishing world and in the Academy. And right now, um, in the Academy, um, people weren't just publishing or writing in writing programs, there's creative, non-fiction in science, narrative, science, narrative medicine, narrative, genetics, um, narrative history, uh, the, the, the idea of communicating information, uh, through narrative gave academics in other departments away to share their research with a larger community
Speaker 3 00:27:59 Lee, we believe it or not are out of time.
Speaker 2 00:28:03 Um, I know how that
Speaker 3 00:28:05 Be. We just started, maybe I'll do a prerecorded integrate with you sometime soon, and we'll just keep in touch. I'll keep in touch with you through Kim, or we'll just keep in touch. Um, so we've been talking with Lee, good kind, uh, author of my last 8,000 days. It's a wonderful book. Uh, if you want to read it, if you're young or old or in between, it's, it's a really great book. So thank you very much, Lee. Uh, we'll keep in touch.
Speaker 2 00:28:35 Terrific. Have a good evening.
Speaker 3 00:28:37 You too. And now this
Speaker 2 00:28:40 <inaudible>,
Speaker 3 00:28:51 You are listening to KFA 90.3 FM in Minneapolis and on the
[email protected]. I'm Liz olds. And this is your what's happening calendar of literary events brought to you by the rain taxi review of books on Wednesday. Number 18th from seven to 8:00 PM. Books and bars discusses virtually the glass hotel by Emily st. John Mandel on Wednesday, November 18th, from 7:00 PM to 8:00 PM. Eat my words. Bookstore in conjunction with Mayo clinic press presents the digital event for dr. Victor. Montori his new book. Why we revolt in conversation with Ryan Armbruster on Thursday, November 19th from six 30 to 7:30 PM. Next chapter book sellers, and the bridges reading series presented virtual reading with Roy G Goosmann, Danica <inaudible> Levi, Danica stigma. And we may Claudia Hampton daily, John McNeil and Richard Tarell. The link will be on their website. Next chapter bookstore sellers on Thursday, November 19th, from 7:00 PM to 8:00 PM. Subtext books is pleased to present a virtual event with William Souder to celebrate the release of bad at the world.
Speaker 3 00:30:07 A life of John Steinbeck in conversation with Daniel Slager on Friday, November 20th, from five 30 to 6:00 PM, go behind the scenes of rain, taxis 20th annual twin cities book festival to find out how the sausage gets made and ask your questions. I assume that's online at the rain taxi book, a site on Friday, November 20th, from 6:00 PM to 8:00 PM. Trans arts speaks presents the be heard 2020 Minnesota youth poetry showcase digitally rescheduled from the spring on Friday, November 20th, from 7:00 PM to 8:00 PM. Next chapter booksellers presents a virtual event for the new story collection. Some people let you down by Malik, Mike alberdi and on Monday, November 23rd, from 7:00 PM to 8:00 PM. Next chapter book sellers presents a virtual event for Charlie Baxter's new novel, the sun collective. This has been your what's happening calendar of literary events brought to you by the rain taxi review of books. There are many other events you can check
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[email protected]. Please have the event info to that email by Monday, prior to the event. And now this Hello, everyone. Can you hear me?
Speaker 0 00:31:50 Yes. Okay. You're both on the air.
Speaker 4 00:31:54 Thank you, Josh. I was muted there for a minute. How about that? It's not like the first time I had been on zoom. Thank you, Josh. Thank you, Liz. Hello, Dan. Hi, Dave. How are you? I'm pretty good. Thank you very much. You know what, Dan, it's entirely appropriate in these days, call them what you want, but that we have a comedian and absurdist port and, uh, a guy who dabbles on daddy is nonsense. Don't you think it seems like about the right time for it or the worst possible time for it? I can decide Dave. I go day to day on this. Well, let's go with the good, um, and let's start, uh, Dan, if you would, uh, telling us a little bit about yourself. Cause I think if we learn a bit, a little bit about, about you and what you've been your career, the kind of work you've been doing, that'll help give us a sense for the book that we're going to talk about here.
Speaker 5 00:32:41 Sure. Well, I've done a lot of work in communications. Obviously. I was company spokesperson for several years. Um, that really got me past a fear of public speaking. Uh, I tell you what, before that, uh, speaking was really horrible. Uh, it was, uh, stressful. I could almost throw up sometimes after, uh, after giving a speech. And, uh, in that role, I really grew as a person and as a performer. And, uh, I've also done some comedy, some standup comedy, uh, to, um, I would say, uh, some good, some bad, there were some nights I kind of thought, Hey, I'm going to be a comedian. And then there were some nights I thought, you know what? I'm never going to go near a comedy club again. So basically, uh, somewhere in the middle there is where I fall. Dave, uh, comedy has always been a love of mine. I grew up reading mad magazine, watching w care peon, Cincinnati mash, um, you know, the Bob Newhart show. I mean, it's just in my blood. I feel like people in my generation comedy is just part of who we are and, uh, I've never been able to quite get away from it.
Speaker 4 00:33:43 Well, the fascinating, thanks for sharing that about, um, your inability, which many of us share, or is it difficulty in performing on stage if you will? So, uh, w w what came first for you is the desire to javelin comedy or to write, or did it all sort of come together?
Speaker 5 00:34:01 I think my first thought was I'll be the writer guy. I'll be the funny guy in the back of the room that passes someone, a funny note, they can read it. And then later I'll say, you know, I wrote that, but you learn pretty quickly that, uh, you know, most comments have their own material, have their own directions. So you kind of realize, Hey, it's, uh, if I want to get my stuff out there, the only choices to get up on stage and grab the microphone. And, uh, I will say it's a unique experience doing standup comedy. It's sort of like, I remember it being it's like all the sound in the room gets sucked up into you and it's your responsibility to fill it back up with laughs and that's a pretty big responsibility. Sometimes I was up to it some nights I was not. Wow,
Speaker 4 00:34:38 Well, I I'm impressed. Uh, it sounds as difficult as I imagined it to be. Uh, I think we're going to get back to talking about comedy, but let's talk about the book right now. And, uh, I I've seen some, uh, when it comes to poetry and other sorts of verse, if you will, um, some pretty unique, uh, formatting, if you will. And, uh, and, uh, this is certainly one of those books, which is to say there's a couple of poems or bits or pieces on every page. And then at the bottom of footnoted italicize, sort of epigram epigraph, whatever the term might be. Uh, talk to us about what, how this book looks and why it took that shape. And then I'd like you to read for us.
Speaker 5 00:35:21 Sure. Well, there's a lot of short pieces in there. Like you said, my philosophy is if it's funny, it works. And if it's funny, it belongs in there. So I tried to really pare it down and get away from straight poetry. I always had a, you know, poems with a comedic bands. This is more, I think it's a much closer to standup comedy and the asides of the bottom of the page are really my attempt to sort of get that in the moment. Uh, you know, comedians, uh, point of view out there. I often find when I watch a comedian, uh, they're off the cuff observations or when they're improving, sometimes those were among the funniest moments of the night for me. So I try to incorporate some of that to give it the feel of an actual comedy album.
Speaker 4 00:35:56 So are these, uh, are these bits of yours, if you will, to use a, uh, an official term?
Speaker 5 00:36:02 Yeah, I'd say they're bedside. I think it qualifies some of them definitely. There's some recurring themes in there too, kind of running gags, you know, in a near comic. And I, I learned this the hard way you need to have, you know, callbacks basically a word or a phrase, you work into your routine and then throughout the night you can come back to that line, even just saying a word or a short phrase and people start laughing just because you've built it up that much. So the rest of you running gags in here that I think really kind of hold the piece together and give it a nice bit of flow. I think, well, someone told me, you know, Hey, by the end, I was looking for more, uh, more jokes about you walking into the bar with the horse and as like, okay, that's, that's good. I'm glad to hear that
Speaker 4 00:36:38 A classic setup and B B before I turn it over to you to read, um, it it's, uh, the format is also, I guess, set up like an album. There's an, a side and a B side, uh, which is nice. It's, uh, it looks good. It feels good. It feels like you're holding some sort of record, some sort of album. Is there a rhyme or reason to what's inside of your, say B
Speaker 5 00:36:58 You know, and not so much? I think just to give it that breath. I do think again, I grew up, uh, I didn't listen to a ton of them, but obviously I was very aware of the Bob Newhart comedy albums, Richard Pryor, obviously. I mean, these are giants. This is my very, very minor from the shadows effort to emulate them and at least put something down akin to a comedy album on paper, which is a pretty weird concept when you think about it. But the more I kind of went with it and my book designer kind of fleshed it out, it actually kind of worked.
Speaker 4 00:37:26 Yeah. Yeah. I think it does too. Um, so Dan would like to turn it over to you to give us a sense for what's in the book and, uh, the are brief items. So, uh, please feel free to, uh, uh, give us a few.
Speaker 5 00:37:40 You guys are outbounds a couple of few Dave I'll bounce a couple off you. This one's called trout camp. When I was young, my parents sent me to trout camp, but I wasn't like the other kids. They were all trumped. And that was a big part of this. Dave is not fitting in. I feel like, uh, starting out in life, everyone got like a handbook and it never made its way to me. So I had to kind of learn the hard way. So that's sort of my little riff on that. Uh, and here's another one called paradise lost and other short one, I was pretty lazy when I was young. So lazy that hadn't been an option. I probably would've hired Lewis and Clark to explore my sexuality who knows, but those two Intrepid explorers might've found, I guess we'll never know. And I kinda liked that too. It just like the undiscovered country. Then we missed that opportunity. It's gone. Now. I just kind of, I don't know something about that. Just kind of spoke to me and the idea of Lewis and Clark exploring someone's sexuality, kind of, it made me laugh when I thought, if it made me laugh, maybe it'll make someone else laugh.
Speaker 4 00:38:40 So I have to tell you right off the bat, I I'm enjoying hearing you read these and in effect performing them, not maybe as you would on stage, but because you'd be racking to a crowd, et cetera. But, um, uh, they, they, they pop off the page and, uh, I like that. Uh, so, but, but you hinted at something when you read Trump camp, um, which is that you are in, there's a lot of jokes in here, but like a lot of comedy, there's some pain, there's some real Dan in here, right? Oh yeah. And, uh, I wonder if he could, I was thinking of, Oh gosh, the footnote on page 21, um, Aqua city motel, that poem, uh, the footnote on page 12. I don't know if you want to read any of those or read some other examples of where, um, Dan comes through, you know, more than just giving us a joke. We're getting some, you know, some real Dan, if you will, and then sort of, I want to talk to you about, I'm sure that's draining yourself into the poems.
Speaker 5 00:39:44 Those are great prompts, Dave. I appreciate it. Yeah. I'll read the footnote at the bottom of page 21. Okay. Ladies and gentlemen, I want you all to like me and you have no idea how much that makes me low of myself. No idea whatsoever. Take a lot of comics. There is a crowd pleasing mentality, and it's almost like I think a drug in some cases like once you get a taste of it, uh you're like you, you always want to push that button. I finally at the age of 50 and by the way, I just turned 50 today. I feel like I'm, I'm kind of over that. Well, thank you. I feel like I'm kind of over that. I'm always looking for a laugh or a good concept, but I don't, I feel like now I'm kind of bad to be in the kid in the back of the room was more comfortable letting other people kind of take center stage.
Speaker 5 00:40:24 But, uh, yeah, there is that element in there of kind of love, hate, you know, sort of like, yeah, I love what I do. And yet there was also that other side that makes me feel not as good, but I'm over that now. I'm, I'm comfortable with who I am. And I think comedy is a big part of who I am. So I'm, I'm much better with it now, but I read Aqua city motel by the way, Dave, which is a real hotel here in the twin cities. I don't know if you knew that. Yeah, it's a real hotel. So here's Aqua city motel, like a lobster. I have a hard outer shell and like a lobster. I do not give up my meat easily. No, if you want it, you have to work for it to Pierce my heart outer shell. I mean, what'd you think I meant sickos and there was a lot of that in there too. A lot of, um, you know, just not twisted exactly, but yeah, kind of twisted stuff in there that hopefully some people will enjoy it.
Speaker 4 00:41:14 Well, yes, but also very real and very raw. Um, you could stop, you could S it's it's, uh, it becomes almost a confessional poem, uh, of use, you know, talking about this protection is, you know, layer of protection that you have for yourself. And, uh, um, you know, I'd like to push you a little more on this idea of pain and comedy, because I think a lot of when we talk to poets, um, a lot of that pain comes through, uh, in their poems. Uh, and, and they, and I think maybe some of them use it as maybe a form of therapy. I mean, I see poets, I see comics up on stage and I'm going to stop babbling and they're really spilling their blood on the stage if you will. Um, uh, do, do you need to do that for this to work for you? I mean, do you need to feel exposed like this lobster?
Speaker 5 00:42:07 I think, yeah. Lobsters do. I think what really grabbed me about them is that layer of protection and how even that isn't enough on this world. So it sort of me is it is kind of me letting down my guard, I guess. And I think what I've learned about writing and comedy is if you want people to remember it, or, you know, really get struck by it, you have to give them something from the bottom of your soul. I mean, you have to kind of give up your treasure, so to speak, and then your secrets, I guess. So to me, this book has a lot of that. I mean, it's a kin to, um, taking off the suit of armor and walking out and waving to the folks and realizing that leaves you open to all kinds of stuff. I mean, putting out a book, um, you know, certainly, uh, you could be any kinds of any kind of criticism or people say, nah, it wasn't for me.
Speaker 5 00:42:47 And you know, it does take a bit of, uh, courage, I think. And, uh, for me to get to this point where I'm comfortable doing it, rolling the dice, if you will, it's it's, it makes me feel good. And I know I've still got a long ways to go, but I'm very pleased with how this book turned out. And, uh, again, a lot of good feedback. I had some readers give me some, one person said, you know, it's, it's kind of pervy. Maybe you could talk tone that down a bit. So I actually did tone it down from about an 11 to about eight and a half. And I think it made it a much better collection.
Speaker 4 00:43:17 Um, do you consider yourself a poet now?
Speaker 5 00:43:21 You know, that's the hard part for me, Dave? Honestly, I feel like I'm somewhere between a writer, a poet and a comedian, and it's just, you know, in the writing industry, as you probably know, uh, agents and publishers, they really don't want a Jack of all trades or someone that falls into the cracks. They want someone who's this and will be that time and time again. And, uh, so I realized it would be kind of beneficial for me to find a niche and stick with it. But, um, for me, poetry has been a pretty good vehicle to sneak some comedy out into the world. And I'm in this one, I'm getting closer to kind of back to that standup act. And, and I don't know what the next step is. Maybe it's, uh, pushing it even further. Maybe it's going up to 14 next time with the, with the raunchy stuff or the out there stuff. Um, you know, I'm just trying to figure it out one step at a time, but this seemed like the right step at this stage.
Speaker 4 00:44:08 Sure. How does this work vary from dark glasses?
Speaker 5 00:44:12 Yeah. Dark glasses was really after written largely after a time of a lot of other people in my life and sort of coming to terms with that. And prior to dark glasses, I'd written all my stuff under the pen name, Henry rifle. So there are two that was really kind of just dropped in the shades because Henry rifle always wore sunglasses, migrate, disguise, uh, and, and drop the shades and, and just kind of came out and said, you know, I'm finally at a point where I'm comfortable telling you who I am and taking ownership of this. And, uh, that was, that was a big leap too. And it, it also felt very good. I mean, it's just like everything, I've, everything I've learned in life is if you take that jump, you take that leap as scary as it might be. There are good things on the other side. Yeah.
Speaker 4 00:44:52 Yeah. That's well said. Uh, we're talking to Dan Hendrickson about his new collection called comedy album. Uh, and you're listening to right on radio on K FAI, FM 90.3. Thank you all. Uh, Dan, tell us where our listeners can find your book.
Speaker 5 00:45:10 You bet. Well, there's only a few places online, of course, at any number of sites, including of course the, the giant monster Amazon, uh, here in Hopkins, Minnesota, you can buy it at a bookstore called prima Amber's bookstore coffee shop, uh, brewpub, great little place. And if you happen to be in Fargo, North Dakota, you can buy it at Zan burrows variety on may and on Broadway and Fargo, a great little store. One of my favorite places in the world, the pandemic of course is affected everybody. If it wasn't for that, I'd like to think I could get into a few more places, but really I've just been trying to pick my shots at places. I have connections
Speaker 4 00:45:43 Good for you. And, uh, you have a website, you have a blog and it's kind of a cool blog. Thanks for sending me a note in advance. Um, w what, what are you trying to do with your blog, Dan, and who do you think your audience is?
Speaker 5 00:45:55 You know, my blog is slowly incrementally growing. I think my blog is a bit of my dumping ground and kind of my lab, if you will, and I'll hit on a concept and I'll put a couple of posts out there about that concept. My most recent one that I felt kind of good about was how to be a writer, a I think an eight part series telling people how to be a writer, very tongue in cheek, um, you know, sort of a big kind of a, a laugh, but the whole industry and how complex and hard it is to get much of anything accomplished. Um, so anyways, I really just, if I have a good notion, I think, Hey, this is a good couple of paragraphs. Keep it kinda short, something quick and easy. I put it out there. And sometimes there some hits, sometimes people like it other times, it's it falls on deaf ears and that's with everything these days. I think
Speaker 4 00:46:39 I enjoyed that, how to be a writer series. That was very clever.
Speaker 5 00:46:43 Thanks, Dave. Yeah. And I was, John Grisham was kind of my, you know, he's sort of the, uh, my white whale, if you will. I always dream of us selling like one 10,000 as many books as Sam or one, 1 million, I guess. But anyway, so there was a good riff in there and John Grisham, I was really happy with that. Yeah.
Speaker 4 00:46:58 Uh, so let's talk about comedy in the age of COVID. Um, you can't go to a club anymore. Maybe you can some, but I don't know, maybe North Dakota, I don't know. But, uh, how does, how do you get in comedy done these days? What do you guys, what are you guys doing?
Speaker 5 00:47:13 You know, it's, it's hard. I know some comedy clubs are, I do keep an eye on it. Uh, still them, some comedy clubs are doing virtual performances, which is great. I mean, I'm all for anything that keeps things going. I think we know artists and bartenders, waitstaff, eh, there's a lot of people suffering through this. So anything they can do to keep this going, keep that fire going. I know like a lot of people, I was really bummed out recently when city pages, um, you know, went under, hopefully it can be, uh, you know, brought back to life someday, but it's not easy. And I, as far as comedy album too, I'm always trying to tell people, you know, it's, it's probably not the best time for this book, but maybe in another way, it makes some kind of sense. I mean, because there's always bad things in life. The world is not a funny place. And that is why I've told people. I consider what I do sort of a form of protest. I mean, it's just kind of like saying, okay, the world makes all kinds of sense. And yet here we are. So maybe nonsense deserves another look. Maybe a, if we try looking at this from another angle, took things less seriously and who knows, maybe we'd wind up in a better place, but yeah, the world's pretty heavy right now, Dave, there's no getting around that.
Speaker 4 00:48:11 Yeah. And thankfully, thankfully we have comedians trying to do what they do. A sit down, there was a poem, which I'm flipping through the book right now, and I'm not quite finding it, which mentions Richard Brodigan. And it's been so many years since I've even seen that name. I used to have one of his books. The name is escaping me, I'm that old. Um, but how anyone knows who Richard Brodigan is, is just made my day. And, um, how do you know what I'm saying? What Manet's, it's called Manet's your poem is mayonnaise. Um, why don't you read that for us and tell us how in the world, uh, Richard Brodigan came into your life.
Speaker 5 00:48:46 If you can hit me with the page, I'd love to read it. And I'll tell you about Richard Brodigan. I found his book, trout fishing in America in college. And, uh, it, it really, um, it blew my mind and first it really made me feel great. Like, okay, I'm not the only weirdo out here who has thoughts like this. And it just, it made me laugh. It's a book I can pick up pretty much on any day, flip through it and find something that makes me laugh. And, uh, you know, it's just a really unusual book is probably not for everybody. But, uh, as far as, as far as me, I it's a book. All I always look at as a touchstone and kind of a, kind of a jumping off point,
Speaker 4 00:49:20 But that makes sense. That's great. And it's page 34. Thank you. Yep.
Speaker 5 00:49:25 Okay. Mayonnaise for Richard Brodigan in one of my to-go orders recently, a restaurant gave me a packet of real mail. I don't want any real Mayo. Thank you. I want the counterfeit stuff, the funnier, the better everything else in this world is fake. So let's keep things consistent. Don't think for a minute, you're going to come in here at the 11th hour, hand me a packet of real mail, and somehow everything's going to be groovy and delicious. It's not, and you know, it put that on your sandwiches.
Speaker 4 00:49:59 Thank you. And thank you for reminding me about Richard Brodigan writing and the, yeah. You're kind of, um, um, a descendant of his, and that's a compliment. Uh, so good for you. Uh, you, you strike me down as someone who walks around with a little notebook in his back pocket and in a pin and clip to a shirt or something like that.
Speaker 5 00:50:19 Yeah. The pen for sure. Uh, and you know, the notebook previously was sticky notes. I used to have a little pad of sticky notes now, of course, with my iPhone is with me all the time. And I'll, I'll, you know, pop things down as I go along through my day. If you have time for a quick story, I'll tell you just how I get sort of my ideas. Sometimes I was going to st. Paul trying to find a gift cards or somebody. And, um, bottom line is I ended up in the restroom, uh, and I had put on surgery to get there, the, you know, the GPS to get there. And then the restroom, as I was beginning to do what people do in a restroom. And let's not take that too far, uh, in my pocket and Siri chirps you've arrived. And I said, thank you, sir. That'll be all. It's just weird. Things happened to me all the time, Dave, I'm sure they happen all of us. And I do my best to jot them down and think maybe that'll come in handy someday.
Speaker 4 00:51:07 So how do you work? How do you work through them? I mean, a poet wouldn't sit, some can crank them up most, sit in, you know, a marinade for a long time. Is that true with these bits? Or do they just sort of, are they on one and done,
Speaker 5 00:51:18 So I'm coming out kind of pre-packaged or almost ready to roll off right there. And then others, like you said, it's sort of like, this is an interesting concept and, you know, I sort of keep those on the front burner, maybe add a couple of lines or, you know, try to run with it and see where it goes. And then maybe a month later something hits me like a good, a good closing line and, you know, in poetry or comedy, you know, it's kind of that leave him laughing kind of things. That's what I'm always kind of looking for.
Speaker 4 00:51:42 You work these out loud. Do, do you sit, uh, writers work alone? And we just had a lovely conversation with Liz in the previous one, talking about the loneliness of being a writer. Um, do you break that loneliness by reading to yourself out loud?
Speaker 5 00:51:56 Yeah, I do read a lot of them out loud. It helps me and I, I, you know, the, one of the things I do credit myself with is I think I've got a pretty good a year. I mean, I don't know. I, I wouldn't say I've done anything to develop that to somebody just kind of given. So I do kind of know what sounds good or a nice line. It always kind of hits me, especially if someone else's two, it jumps out at me from 100 miles away when, you know, and, and there's tons of great writers out there obviously, but I do have a pretty good ear and I kind of go with that and trust my gut and writing is one of the few places or one of the few things I do or actually do kind of trust myself and feel good doing that. And, um, so it's kind of a leap of faith, like I said earlier.
Speaker 4 00:52:32 Right, right. Um, this is a book like Brodigan where you can open up bend, uh, you know, take a little bite here and there enjoy, enjoy peace, uh, and, and flipper flipper on, uh, do you intend people to read this straight through or, or to do that, to sort of, um,
Speaker 5 00:52:50 Well I think that the dream is they read a straight through they're hooked and they just blast through it. Uh, I think the reality of it is, uh, as a friend of mine noted on, he reviewed my book recently kindly, you know, as a friend. And he said, but I didn't prompt him. I mean, he wrote it out of his own Goodwill, I guess, but bottom line, he said, Dan, put some good stuff out there. Great bathroom reading, which I know Berk Berkeley breeds who writes bloom County said he couldn't even imagine all of his books sitting and going. You buy toilet bowls out there, out there in America, which I found very funny.
Speaker 4 00:53:24 That's hilarious, but you know what? That's okay. That's, that's pretty good compliment too. Um, do you have anything else you'd like to read for us then? Sure.
Speaker 5 00:53:32 I can read one more. And this is sort of a, I guess I'd call it kind of a Keystone poem. Um, it, it basically involves a situation when I was young and, uh, I referred to a pair of pants as short pants. And, um, I'm telling you it, it was just, it, it absolutely blew up. My friends went crazy. They still talk about it to this day. I can't find it right now, but basically just know that when I was a kid, I showed up at a park and I said, yeah, you know, it was warm out. I'm wearing short pants. And it was as though the world stopped. I mean, like stop rotating, the bird stop singing. And my friends looked at me and they'd never heard short pants before. He was just shorts, kids wear shorts. Right. He wears shorts outside anyways. Uh, short pants became my, uh, that's my cross to bear in this world.
Speaker 5 00:54:20 I'll probably be hearing about that when I'm 75 on my death bed. But, uh, you know, so bottom line there, it kind of goes back to that, not having that manual, that manual, everyone else got at the start of life. And, uh, so that drove a poem in this book. And it's just one of those things where no matter what I do, I always say 10 people could walk into a room. Nobody would laugh. I'd walk in as number 11, do the same thing everyone else did. And everyone would just bust out laughing, like, look at that guy. What's he doing? What's he doing? And I would have no idea what they're talking about and yet they'd be laughing.
Speaker 4 00:54:48 Well, that's great. Uh, and then somehow again, I go back to the beginning, which I was surprised to hear you say that, uh, it took you a while to get up the courage to do what you're doing. Um, uh, but I th th there you go, uh, it is what it is. I admire that I'm going to, I'm going to point you to more dessert on page one 16.
Speaker 5 00:55:11 Okay. And how funny, I, I'm not even lying I'm on that page actually. So there is a bit, uh, throughout the book, run, leading a horse into a friend's bar as a joke, and there's like five bits like this. So this is the last one.
Speaker 4 00:55:22 Well, do you want to set it up with another one or no,
Speaker 5 00:55:25 I think this works. I think this works. So basically just know I'm trying to play a joke on my friend, the bar owner, and this one's called more dessert recently, as a joke, I let a horse into a small town bar owned by a good friend of mine. When the bartender noticed us, he frowned and said, the nearest source of fresh water is at least 15 miles from here. I looked at the horse and bowed my head, sadly in defeat. I can't even do this much. Right. High murmured, as we turned around and clipped clots slowly towards the exit,
Speaker 4 00:55:57 One expects a different sort of horse joke, a horse, right?
Speaker 5 00:56:03 Yeah. It's, it's one of those ones that I that's, what really made this book fun is that I had that concept. And then like three or four jokes came in a row and I started thinking, well, all right, this could be something. And I kind of salted those throughout the book. And it ends up kind of holding the piece together, I think.
Speaker 4 00:56:18 Yeah. Dan, do you write every day?
Speaker 5 00:56:21 I would say I write stuff down every day. I wouldn't say actually formally sit down and write, I think in this coming year, I'm going to do my best to push myself to actually do that. It's just a good habit. And I think, you know, it's, it's pretty easy to let concepts kind of build up and stuff, build up. If you get it out every day. I really think there's a better chance a collection could come out. A new collection could come out quicker and more easily than trying to, you know, grind it out over a two month period. Say, sure,
Speaker 4 00:56:47 You hinted at this earlier, but I like to get at this toward the end of our interview and believe it or not, we're already nearing the end of four-star remind our great and dear listeners that we are speaking with Dan Hendrickson about his new collection comedy album, a collection of poems and bits and comedy, uh, unlike you probably haven't picked up in a while. So I encourage everyone to take a look at that and look up Dan Hendrickson online. There'll be able to find your materials then right down.
Speaker 5 00:57:17 Yeah, absolutely. Yep.
Speaker 4 00:57:19 H E N D R I C K S O N. Um, and now I forgot what I was going to ask. What was I going? Oh, what are you going to drive you a little push a little harder on what you're working on next, where you think you might be going, will we see another collection like this, or, um, do you have any other ideas in mind?
Speaker 5 00:57:36 Well, I mean, I think there's always a possibility of going a little further. I mean, I think I went out pretty far from me in terms of boldness and kind of, uh, you know, not in your face. Exactly, but not also, not, not in your face, but I think essentially I'm going to go where things take me. Comedy is sort of pulling me right now. And I, I have always had a, a strong notion of trying to put a movie together, like a screenplay. I have a draft right now. I really, really, really want to get back to punch, you know, punching that up policy NetApp and trying to maybe get that made into a movie, possibly a self-financed movie, that kind of thing. Just you do it yourself and get it out there. That's always been my philosophy.
Speaker 4 00:58:11 We noted one of your pieces in the introduction. Um, uh, have you done many, uh, you know, scripts, uh, does that type of writing,
Speaker 5 00:58:20 Right? I've got one in the can and I need to work on that. I written a, co-written a screenplay with a friend, a memoir of his, we turned into a screenplay, which we're still hoping to get off the ground. I would say I've done enough to feel like I know just a little something about it, but I know I've got miles and miles to go yet as a screen writer and a writer. Of course.
Speaker 4 00:58:38 Yeah, of course. Think we all. Okay. We're getting the wrap up sign. I'm going to just let our listeners know that we are, have been speaking with. And it's been a pleasure. Dan speaking with Dan Hendrickson about his new collection comedy album. Thank you very much, Dan.
Speaker 5 00:58:52 Thanks, Dave. Very much have a good night
Speaker 4 00:58:54 And we hope to see you in a club very soon. Let me do by now back to you,
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